Why the Marvel Cinematic Universe feels empty

  • تم نشره في 2018/10/15
  • What makes a fictional universe good? In this requested episode of Overrated, Vox’s Phil Edwards explores the past and present of fictional universes to try to figure it out.
    Subscribe to our channel! goo.gl/0bsAjO
    Want to read more? Check out Sean Howe’s book about Marvel: www.amazon.com/Marvel-Comics-Untold-Sean-Howe/dp/0061992119

    And explore Tommy’s Universe:

    Fictional universes and crossovers have been around long before the Marvel Cinematic Universe. The Green Hornet radio show had a crossover with the Lone Ranger that kicked off the trend. In comics, the Marvel Universe started long before Stan Lee was at the helm.

    But these crossovers have a problem: They can privilege business relationships ahead of storytelling immersion and really interesting universes. As the Tommy Westphall Universe shows, crossovers often become a map of business decisions rather than of integrated fictional stories, and that leads to worse stories.

    This problem plagues the MCU as well. When Marvel engineers crossovers, they aren’t thinking about a universe transformed by superheroes - they just want more quips, explosions, and cash. Or at least that’s Edwards’s argument - do you think the MCU works?
    Overrated is a series that takes a look at the things we all know - the books, the trends, and the ideas that have become iconic - and answers the question: “Why is this so famous"?
    Vox.com is a news website that helps you cut through the noise and understand what's really driving the events in the headlines. Check out www.vox.com.
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تعليقات • 22 949

  • Vox
    Vox  6 أشهر قبل +936

    You know that one font every comic book uses? Phil Edwards explains where it came from, and how it became so enduring: bit.ly/2EoOE6a

    • Riguy
      Riguy أيام قبل

      +Sasuke all he did was reference other movies and when he finally got to the mcu points, they weren't even points

    • Scott Andersen
      Scott Andersen 3 أيام قبل

      Sasuke the video has so many dislikes because he takes so long to get to the claim he makes in the title and he doesn't acknowledge the facts against his argument. he uses spider man homecoming as a way to make claims against the MCU and at the end says that's what the MCU should be like. the video is factually incorrect and frankly a waste of time.

    • Ribbitt III
      Ribbitt III أشهر قبل

      Vox nobody EXCEPT FANS would notice

  • Just Jessi
    Just Jessi 10 ساعات قبل

    yo. he doesnt even mention that tarentino got the idea for a shared universe from watching mallrats. this video sucks.

  • Alexander Gutierrez
    Alexander Gutierrez 16 ساعات قبل

    This is literally the worst evaluation of anything ever

  • Avi Arad
    Avi Arad 18 ساعات قبل

    Lol the dislikes

  • Zeus
    Zeus 22 ساعات قبل

    Who came here to see the dislike ratio again? 🤣🤣

  • Sergio Mora
    Sergio Mora أيام قبل

    i knew it, littlefinger is alive

  • Express Gaming
    Express Gaming أيام قبل

    I think that the universe where half of the entire population is dead is the one where I’d be most affected

  • Aang Pearce
    Aang Pearce أيام قبل +1

    You should probably delete this video, it's embarrassing.

  • Riguy
    Riguy أيام قبل +1

    What a steaming pile of clickbait

  • Evil Smile邪惡之笑
    Evil Smile邪惡之笑 2 أيام قبل

    so many fillers and it didnt even reach 10 minutes

  • William O'Sullivan
    William O'Sullivan 2 أيام قبل +1

    I am so shore everyone ho liked this video is just a DC fan who didn't even watch the video

    • John
      John 13 ساعات قبل

      +William O'Sullivan no it doesn't, it shows that vox is wrong. Don't be so delusional.

    • William O'Sullivan
      William O'Sullivan 14 ساعات قبل

      You got me there but the fact that this video has more dislikes than likes shows that marvel is better than DC!

    • John
      John 21 ساعات قبل +1

      you could say the same for every marvel fan disliking the video, too

  • William O'Sullivan
    William O'Sullivan 2 أيام قبل +2

    I don't know if you noticed this but this is a stemming pile of click bate

  • Article 12
    Article 12 2 أيام قبل +1

    someone pressed the like button
    me: wait, thats illegal

  • Austen _
    Austen _ 2 أيام قبل

    The like to dislike ratio is overwhelming

  • Diego DeLaO
    Diego DeLaO 2 أيام قبل

    U said that the corporate decisions were abt ratings rather than telling a good story, if ur comparing both of them u will realize that Marvel's been telling a story through all 20+ movies
    Also you're gonna tell me the relationship building spanning from homecoming to infinity war wasnt compelling or caps journey from the end of ww2 to the day and age he's had to adjust to, or even thors redemption isnt compelling storytelling
    Another thing, do u not realize these movies and shows in the universe cant directly just be abt how they take place in the same universe otherwise it devalues the movies and shows, they need to be independent and have their own meaning and when time comes for their humility to show when it matters most, thats what the crossovers are for

  • Tony Stark
    Tony Stark 2 أيام قبل +2

    *sees like to dislike ratio*
    This... does put a smile on my face...

  • Luke Gomer
    Luke Gomer 3 أيام قبل

    How can you possibly talk about Infinity War as if it hasn't 100% earned it's position to bring together all these characters. How can you just pretend 20 movies of world building never happened and act as if Marvel have just randomly thrown out a cash grab movie. Absolutely ridiculous. I am fuming, this is the most uneducated video that has been picked out of the old 'video topic hat' and put together in a mere few minutes by some intern who hasn't watched an MCU movie through it's entirety and believes hes seen enough.

  • Luke Gomer
    Luke Gomer 3 أيام قبل

    I. AM. SCREAMING!!!!!!!!

  • Tyler Winchester
    Tyler Winchester 3 أيام قبل

    Shame. Shame. Shame. Shame. Shame. Shame.

  • The Elite BTROX
    The Elite BTROX 3 أيام قبل +1

    You make the point that Bruce Banner's photo in Homecoming is cool but not a transformed universe (in order to further the argument that the mcu feels empty)... Despite the fact that several characters from the other films play prominent roles in the story. Including Happy Hogan, and Iron man. You can't use Homecoming as an example of an empty and disconected universe when THE OPENING 5 MINUTES is a recap of another movie in the mcu from the point of view of our main character. Civil War and The Avengers movies are the main catalysts for the film's entire plot. If Civil War hadn't happened Peter probably wouldn't have met Iron Man and if The Avengers never happened, Adrian Tomes wouldn't have become the Vulture. These are more than just offhand references and easter eggs, they're entire plot points in the story. Even if they're were only touched upon briefly their effects are felt and their importance is great. Thats what makes a transformed universe. Pictures of Bruce Banner in Peter's science class or a photo of one of the Hollowing Commandos in the principal's office simply seek to further flesh out said transformed universe. And that's only using Homecoming as an example. The plots of Black Panther, Thor Ragnorack, and Infinity War (just to name a few) are all heavily influenced by events in previous movies. So yes just having a photo of another character in one movie isn't a transformed universe. But everything else I just mentioned, IS.

  • MrKevinTaco
    MrKevinTaco 3 أيام قبل

    How the hell would I want a crossover with SW and Marvel? It would make no sense, this video makes no sense

  • MrKevinTaco
    MrKevinTaco 3 أيام قبل

    This is one of the most idiotic things I've seen in my life

  • ChadMillerMusic
    ChadMillerMusic 3 أيام قبل

    After waiting 6 months and rewatching this, I can confidently say; you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about

    GOD THE GAMER 3 أيام قبل

    Look at that like ratio

  • The Yuri Theorist
    The Yuri Theorist 4 أيام قبل

    Congratulations you aged yourself Vox, you shouldn't have touched something you know nothing about especially of you're going to say it's bad and do the most lazy form of research you could possibly do

  • Andrew Rodrigues
    Andrew Rodrigues 4 أيام قبل

    Boring af

  • Abel alarco
    Abel alarco 4 أيام قبل

    This video is sooooo boooooooooooriiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnngggggggg

  • Which Cat
    Which Cat 4 أيام قبل

    the mcu can be overrated, but this video did not make ANY points to back that claim

  • Natalio Fernandes
    Natalio Fernandes 4 أيام قبل

    MCU is the best saga ever made

  • Natalio Fernandes
    Natalio Fernandes 4 أيام قبل


  • Landkrabben
    Landkrabben 4 أيام قبل

    You suck hairy balls dude.

  • Thanosman
    Thanosman 4 أيام قبل

    that the MCU universe is still in development like cracks me up it's further if it's far from the truth the MCU start with Iron Man and now we have what almost like 50 something characters or so in the on-screen together I'd hardly call them right for that point

  • Neph Themis
    Neph Themis 5 أيام قبل

    Now, time to unsubscribe. : )

  • Flying Popcorn Juice
    Flying Popcorn Juice 5 أيام قبل

    October 15th is now Opposite Day on the calendar.

  • Prabhat Raikwar
    Prabhat Raikwar 5 أيام قبل


    • NΛME
      NΛME 2 أيام قبل


  • J.B. Forbes
    J.B. Forbes 5 أيام قبل

    ...and yet the theaters showing MCU films are full, really full, bursting at the seams with customers saying, "Shut up and take my money", full. You are definitely entitled to your opinion, but you've failed to make your argument with me and (at the time of posting this comment) over 105,000 other viewers.

  • Jacob Votava
    Jacob Votava 5 أيام قبل +1

    Unsubbing because this is a steaming pile of clickbait.

  • SOme ONe
    SOme ONe 5 أيام قبل

    It feels empty because there is no build up to any of these character clowns with 'powers'.

    • foop
      foop 3 أيام قبل

      There is no buildup? Yes, you are titled to your opinion, but it can also be wrong. There is so, so much buildup to their powers, origin stories, which build up the characters into 3-dimensional people, in which the audiences have been so invested in that hundreds of millions of people are hyped for the next film.

  • ObiWan Kenobi
    ObiWan Kenobi 6 أيام قبل

    It’s not overrated...............
    All of the movies so far are awesome so why not make so many more

  • Porter Orvetti
    Porter Orvetti 6 أيام قبل

    Okay this entire video is just BS. Your main point is that Disney wants to sell you stuff. That is correct. Does that make the movies bad. Of course not! There’s some really good marvel films out there that your not being fair too. Also all the clips of the toys and stuff in the MCU are showing that the characters are also popular in their world. It’s free advertising sure, but it’s not like the whole movie is an ad.

  • Da Golden Llama
    Da Golden Llama 6 أيام قبل

    This vidie is complete bs and you lied this is a steaming pile of clickbait

  • Tucker Tooley
    Tucker Tooley 6 أيام قبل

    Most of the mcu is a way to intruduce you to characters. That's why these problems exist and space made things way worse for connecting storylines together.

  • Anna Sanderson
    Anna Sanderson 6 أيام قبل

    Of course if DC or marvel broke copy right laws and added Hawkeye to justice league or aqua man in infinity war no one would care even DC and marvel

    P.S. this is a joke comment I know he mentions legal ownership

  • Kade Nielsen
    Kade Nielsen 6 أيام قبل

    Wow, you really are a group of idiots.

  • Abioticspy
    Abioticspy 6 أيام قبل


  • Nova Star
    Nova Star 6 أيام قبل

    Wait... X-Men?
    *laughs like that girl from GoTG when she hears Tazerface's name*
    There is no logic in the MCU or X-Men.
    And I believe they are in the same universe, or in a type of Alternate universe as there has been talk for DPool to meet the Avengers

    • foop
      foop 3 أيام قبل

      The MCU has a better timeline than the X-men, similar to a floating timeline.

  • Nova Star
    Nova Star 6 أيام قبل

    Yes. I do agree with easter eggs - that sometimes isn't enough to say "these are joined and connected universes"
    But. You used Spiderman Homecoming scene.
    Little background info.
    Tom Hollands, Peter Parker, was first introduced in Captain America: Civil War, therefore, Pete is in that same universe. He is introduced along with T'challa, aka, The Black Panther, who is now also connected, and his father, T'chacka, who was killed by Bucky, there fore connecting Wakanda to Bucky and therefore connecting Wakanda and the people within to the Avengers as T'challa's motivation to join the Leipzig fight in the first place was to Avenge his father (pun intended)
    Now back to Spidey.
    Yes. A picture of Bruce is a nice touch - but really, you should be pointing out how; One: that picture was a direct scene from A:AOU and there was no POSSIBLE way they could get it.
    And two: there are no pictures of Tony, or Howard.
    The Avengers masks are also a nice touch, showing how integrated the Avengers are in peoples lives.
    And if that were it, some silly easter eggs, I could maybe see where you were coming from.
    But that isn't it.
    Peter and Ned clearly talk about the Avengers and Peter states that he is "Technically and Avenger"
    This movie also explains his new suit, Tony gave it to him before the fight.
    And, not only is Happy in the movie. Multiple times.
    But Tony is as well. Like. He is kinda a HUGE character in the movie.
    For instance, Tony is the reason Vulture becomes The Vulture.
    The Vulture's whole suit came from the alien tech from the first Avengers film.
    And, Tony is in most of the movie.
    He is in the little scene with the camera
    He says goodbye to Pete.
    Calls Peter at a point.
    Helps Peter only seconds later.
    Takes away Peter's suit AFTER helping him.
    Then gives Pete back the suit and invites him to be an Avenger.
    Peter is directly the reason Tony is marrying Pepper.
    You make it seem that no character is linked and its silly hand off comments that brake it apart.
    But they're linked.
    Steve Rogers, aka Captain America, was best friends with James Buckanan Barnes, aka Bucky Barnes, aka, The Winter Soldier.
    Steve and James know Howard Stark, Tony Stark's father, therefore linking the three.
    It was shown that the Tesseract was then thrown into space where Carol Danvers, aka, Captain Marvel (though not really) found the Tesseract and gave it to Nickolas Jonathan Fury to hide.
    Therefore linking all of them.
    Nick hid the Tesseract without telling SHIELD he did, where it stayed hidden until Avengers.
    Next Thor.
    Thor Odinson, son of Odin and the God of Thunder, has an adoptive brother, Loki.
    Thor was sent to earth, or Midgard, after he fought with his father.
    He there met Jane, Darcy, and Erik, then linking Erik and Thor for the first Avengers.
    He also, briefly, had a run in with SHIELD and Hawkeye, aka, Clint, and I believe Natasha, but I can't remember.
    Connecting them as well.
    Tony Stark is already connected to Cap because of Howard, and this is shown in greater effect in Ironman 2, as his father had a prototype of Caps shield.
    Tony is also introduced to Natasha Romanoff and Phil Coulson through these movies as well as Nick at the end of one of them, which wasn't an "exposition dump" that term describes a long, drawn out dialog by one character on main parts to the story, that wasn't one.
    Peter Parker was also introduced in Ironman, he was the little kid with the Ironman Mask when the drones attacked.
    Bruce was connected to Steve as he was trying to recreate the supersoldier DNA but created the Hulk.
    Tony also KNOWS about Bruce, as shown in Avengers.
    Scott met Sam in Ant Man. Connecting him to both Steve and the Avengers.
    Wanda and Bucky were both HYDRA victims.
    Bucky killed Tony's parents.
    I could go on with DPool. But he doesn't really obey the laws of reality.
    But its hard to say "they aren't joined" when Peter was fighting FOUR of the Avengers in Civil.
    And the excuse?
    Non of them were bad!
    Hank has made it clear he doesn't like Stark.
    Non of the Avengers really cared for what was going on in Homecoming except Tony.
    Ragnarok was on a different planet.
    Carol is in space through these movies and they aren't in any life threatening danger.
    All the characters are connected and do not fall apart.
    Going back the the easter eggs.
    Its clear that the Avengers are big in Peter's universe.
    Taking one look at Peter's suit shows that.
    One glance at the picture of Bruce or the silly Avengers masks.
    But also one glance at the movie's plot.
    Bad guy needs money for his daughter.
    Stark and the Avengers say its too dangerous.
    Bad guy doesn't like Stark.
    Bad guy wants to kill Stark and prove he's better than the Avengers.
    Spidey is the only one who wants to fight this guy.

  • Billy Idol
    Billy Idol 6 أيام قبل

    Song? 2:33

  • Amit Kumar
    Amit Kumar 6 أيام قبل

    You need to get your mind checked for even calling it overrated.

  • Leo Rautenberg
    Leo Rautenberg 6 أيام قبل

    "Again and again" shows one probably fake example

  • Andrew Park
    Andrew Park 7 أيام قبل +1

    This video has over a 100k dislikes, and it satisfies me to see that it does.

  • retro 1055
    retro 1055 7 أيام قبل

    Why is this on my reccomendation i hate it

  • Tanveer Ahmed
    Tanveer Ahmed 7 أيام قبل

    This is a pretty ridiculous video

  • ItsPenguin
    ItsPenguin 7 أيام قبل

    This video gives me such a weird feeling. This guy's talking, but saying nothing at the same time. I sat there for 9 minutes and 38 seconds, and never thought about how bad the video actually was. And it feels... well, empty.

  • Nicholas Tyler Brown
    Nicholas Tyler Brown 7 أيام قبل

    Wtf were you trying to get access with this? This doesn't explain what the video's title states at all.

  • Prince Kashyap
    Prince Kashyap 7 أيام قبل

    _This video is just an experiment to see if the viewers can understand something out of literally nothing_

  • faldostick123
    faldostick123 7 أيام قبل

    Have you ever heard of this cool thing called world building

    F*CK T SERIES 7 أيام قبل

    *when the video has more dislikes than likes...*

  • Daniel
    Daniel 7 أيام قبل

    Apologies here Vox, but you need to stop complaining about others’ creations, and instead focus on doing something more creative yourself.

  • G R
    G R 7 أيام قبل

    Pathetic try to get attention. I really like Vox videos but this is a spot on failure.

  • Sockboi _
    Sockboi _ 8 أيام قبل

    0:16 Why isn't this video just a steaming pile of clickbait?
    Because the video is a steaming pile of crap.

  • jfrader
    jfrader 8 أيام قبل

    This is wrong. X-Men has less characters, so it's easier. Civil War is the shared battle.

  • Game Pirate
    Game Pirate 8 أيام قبل

    The problem with this video is that talks about everything else but the topic at hand. The video could have given specific examples highlighting why Marvels storytelling is supposedly empty and dry. They could have addressed the villain problem. There is no specifics here and goes on and on about this comic book and this theory and so on. Talk about the Marvel CINEMATIC Universe dude. Other forms of entertainment have no relation whatsoever. A disappointing video from Vox!

  • Mizzy Cat
    Mizzy Cat 8 أيام قبل

    I tend to love Vox’s videos, but this video’s just stupid with bad reasoning and comparisons that make no sense. To be honest, this video is very over exaggerated.

  • Harsh Shekhawat
    Harsh Shekhawat 8 أيام قبل

    Phil Edwards (the video guy) every marvel fan hates you

    • foop
      foop 3 أيام قبل

      Every film enthusiast hates him

  • juwann lowe
    juwann lowe 8 أيام قبل +1

    This video essay feels empty

  • Amadou Diallo
    Amadou Diallo 9 أيام قبل

    Please stop making videos, everyone who viewed this video lost 20IQ points

  • Tiny Rock
    Tiny Rock 9 أيام قبل

    I was looking for why I think the movies are boring. Come on!

    RAVI SHANKAR 9 أيام قبل

    Bullshit 💩💩

  • Matrix Man
    Matrix Man 9 أيام قبل

    If people don't like crossovers, then why do producer create them?

  • WOMB0
    WOMB0 9 أيام قبل

    I thought that he would be taking about it the lack of opportunities marvel couldve took to include or Reference more heroes or villains

  • OptimusCam 04
    OptimusCam 04 9 أيام قبل

    This dude literally repeated that the mcu is overrated like 10 times but never gave any strong facts. Honestly this is one of the worst vox videos I’ve ever seen.

  • Kurious Kat
    Kurious Kat 10 أيام قبل

    and who are u?!

  • Lorenzo Marsella
    Lorenzo Marsella 10 أيام قبل

    Dumbest video on YT.

  • Anand Roy
    Anand Roy 10 أيام قبل +2

    So.. What was the point of this 9 minute long video?


  • Wolf of the West
    Wolf of the West 10 أيام قبل

    Yeah...I didn't get this at all. The X-Men movies are an incoherent mess, and the argument didn't make any sense. The X_men universe is good because it allows for decade hoping and tonally different movies? Uh...how is it that the MCU doesn't do that? The MCU is BETTER at that than the X-Men universe.

    And you're point about Jessica Jones was dumb. The point of the merch was that the Avengers are big celebrity heroes after the Battle of New York. Far more references are made to "the Incident," and it's vital to the Daredevil series, as the destruction of the BoNY create the opportunity for Fisk to rise up. It also fueled the fear and hatred that lead the anti-superhuman vigilantes to target Jessica.

  • Gerardo Guerra
    Gerardo Guerra 10 أيام قبل


  • Bruno Tapia Garcia
    Bruno Tapia Garcia 10 أيام قبل

    just came to drop a dislike and dip

  • Lord Boneless
    Lord Boneless 10 أيام قبل

    The points you made were really misleading

  • Hishaam Khan
    Hishaam Khan 10 أيام قبل

    He has apoint

  • Tilted Maples
    Tilted Maples 10 أيام قبل

    I don't know how Vox could get a worse like to dislike ratio than some of their political videos, but they achieved it.
    Edit: Grammar

  • Srish Kumar
    Srish Kumar 11 أيام قبل +1

    This is by far one of the worst videos you guys have made. Did you even watch the movies??

  • Earl Patrick
    Earl Patrick 11 أيام قبل

    I see what your point is. Profit > content.
    But using X-men was a horrible comparison.
    In addition, ever thought that sometimes its just for entertainment? That you want to get out of your own universe. Thats what movies are for. Its why people go to the theatres. To get you out of your own mind or in this case, your own “universe”

  • craig rivet
    craig rivet 11 أيام قبل

    I just wasted 10 minutes of my life

  • SpeciamDraws
    SpeciamDraws 11 أيام قبل

    Oh meh gersh yes finally somone agrees that marvel is over rated.

  • Ethan Pierce
    Ethan Pierce 11 أيام قبل

    Most your videos are crap about real life. This is crap about not-real life.

  • Auburny Foris
    Auburny Foris 11 أيام قبل

    Y’all should delete this vid tbh

  • Auburny Foris
    Auburny Foris 11 أيام قبل

    I hate how angry this video made me. Marvel owns my whole soul

  • S J
    S J 11 أيام قبل

    Look at the like and dislike ratio

  • Park Chaeyoung
    Park Chaeyoung 12 أيام قبل

    Lol the triggered kids in the comment is so stupid and ridiculous

  • Caitlin Albertyn
    Caitlin Albertyn 12 أيام قبل +1

    I love not watching any of the movies and seeing fans mad as hell in the comments. People are really saying he should be fired for this 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

    INDIAN ROVIO 12 أيام قبل +4

    This man is just forced to do this video by *THANOS*

    • Nova Star
      Nova Star 6 أيام قبل

      I don't think even Thanos would want this video to exist.

  • Jonathan Ruiz
    Jonathan Ruiz 12 أيام قبل

    Phil Edwards is big pp head

  • Rayquaza Δ
    Rayquaza Δ 12 أيام قبل

    What a steaming pile of clickbait, that wasn’t even a *good* try.

  • Creeper Nova
    Creeper Nova 12 أيام قبل

    Please tell me he didn’t just say that the X-Men time line makes more sense than the MCU timeline

    FODAUM RUBRAUM 12 أيام قبل

    He only said one thing right in this video:
    MCU is overrated.
    That's true, and it's ridiculously overrated, but after that he kinda showed horrible arguments to prove his point.

  • Artemis Jace
    Artemis Jace 12 أيام قبل

    MCU definetly has some problems but this video cites like... none of them? I really don't get the point.

  • M C
    M C 13 أيام قبل +1

    Marvel crossed over all these mcu characters before they made them into movies, they're called Marvel Comics. Btw I love mcu's crossovers.

  • da wae
    da wae 13 أيام قبل

    I think the MCU is overrated, but this dude is doodoo.

  • gamingpineapple13
    gamingpineapple13 13 أيام قبل

    Isn't the verge working for vox